Stick Holding

Quite frankly, I rarely if ever pay attention to what grip a guy is using as opposed to what they're playg in & of itself [to "apply or guage it to my own playg"].

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there are definitely some great matched-grip players that can get that flow and "finesse" in the left hand-Novak, Bill Stewart, Cliff Almond, Dennis

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Also, W Kennedy is another prime example of great playing w matched [his 'doubles' da**-sure don't suck ;c)]...& BBlade has been sighted playg matched AW....;c)

Here is a subtlely brilliant HB funny along this same mindset, orig quoted from ladanny in the "Open-Handed Playing - Leading With The Left-Hand" topic:

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"Anyone play open-handed traditional grip?!"

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">[img]wink.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ March 29, 2004 02:00 PM: Message edited by: FuseU1 ]</font>

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Originally posted by jonthibault:
Virgil plays traditional, Vinnie plays traditional, Weckl plays traditional. Traditional is better. Makes for easier doubles.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">there must be a valid reason for why they chose to stick with trad grip for most of their playing. i agree that there are really good match grip players but honestly they are not breaking as much ground nor expanding the levels of the drum set as much as these three guys. there is a common smoothness in flow with these pro trad players that match grip players don't exactly have. i don't know if it's because of doubles or what not but it's there.

I think they just do it to look cool [img]tongue.gif[/img]
( j/k)

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Virgil plays traditional, Vinnie plays traditional, Weckl plays traditional. Traditional is better. Makes for easier doubles...
...there must be a valid reason for why they chose to stick with trad grip for most of their playing. i agree that there are really good match grip players but honestly they are not breaking as much ground nor expanding the levels of the drum set as much as these three guys. there is a common smoothness in flow with these pro trad players that match grip players don't exactly have. i don't know if it's because of doubles or what not but it's there.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Valid reason #1: they originally started w trad [& throughout their formative years, AWA continued w it, playg it mostly].

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ March 29, 2004 02:34 PM: Message edited by: FuseU1 ]</font>

How's this for a reason to play traditional?

If you can play trad, you can play matched. The reverse is not true at all.

It's like two grips in one! [img]tongue.gif[/img]

DOH!!
That probably might be true. [img]wink.gif[/img] [img]redface.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

I started w matched & later during the formative yrs i started learning trad in private lessons w a great jazz/latin drummer...but i am still more comf w matched, that's why i made that analogy ;c)

But again [& like lad said], certainly you wouldn't play open-handed w trad! [img]tongue.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ March 29, 2004 03:02 PM: Message edited by: FuseU1 ]</font>

Well, this is a combustible subject, isn't it?

[img]smile.gif[/img]

If your doubles aren't as good, matched, in my view, they just need work... That's all.

A trad player that doubles well is doing half of it, matched.

Whatever you do, do it well. That's all I ask.

[img]cool.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ March 29, 2004 05:00 PM: Message edited by: peter c ]</font>

After 10 years of playing traditional and being frustrated with my left hand I made the big switch to matched. After playing matched for the last 30 years, I'm still glad I made the switch.

Steve's point is well taken. The two grips do not sound the same. If you're after the trad. sound go for it. If matched makes more sense, than use that. If you have the time and the desire...work them both up!

Andy

Although this debate is pretty much, just a debate, imo. There are no ways to prove either side and there are pros and cons to whichever route you choose. Way too many factors involved. I'd say some people have (small) physical advantages, but really it's a thing impossible to achieve without many hours of practice. I don't think that these differences in natural speed limits and control(like comparing Lang to Mangini) are very large however, and few ever reach them anyways. I'd say you're cheating yourself out of the expressiveness of the instrument if you only use 1 technique. So I'd say that the most important thing here is DETERMINATION.

So I think at some point all of us have to say, "I appreciate what I have" and not be so competitive with ourselves and others. It's an ego thing really. Many musicians suffer from it. You have to as they say, "Play YOUR Game" and focus on developing and polishing a style that others can identify you with. Honestly when it comes right down to it I'm very ignorant musically and don't know how to prove or dis-prove anything other than say, heres one way, and here's another, and here's a hybrid LOL. There are times when I would like to say more about players I hear but just don't have the ability to convey my thoughts I guess. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, since it's just one person's opinion, even if it comes from a self proclaimed guru [img]wink.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ March 29, 2004 09:19 PM: Message edited by: Bozzio ]</font>

It's just a matter of what style you like. I like more doubles-oriented playing, so I learned how to play traditional grip (after a loooooong time of playing matched), and now it's easier for me to play that style. If you want to play with blistering singles a la Dennis, then it's okay to play matched (my singles are still more powerful with matched grip). I have never heard anyone play that "smooth doubles" style with matched grip.